12
$\begingroup$

Analytic sets are projections of Borel sets, and are known to be Lebesgue measurable (in fact universally measurable). The question of whether measurability of analytic sets can be shown in some standard subsystem of second order arithmetic has been discussed on MO, and apparently was recently solved: analytic measurability is equivalent over $\mathrm{ATR_0}$ to $\Pi^1_1$-CA$_0$. (I am an outsider and not sure why $\mathrm{ATR_0}$ rather than $\mathrm{RCA_0}$ is chosen to be the base theory. Is it the most convenient place to develop measure theory?)

The next natural question is measurability of $\mathbf{\Sigma^1_2}$ sets, namely projections of complements of analytic sets. $\mathbf{\Sigma^1_2}$-measurability is independent of $\mathsf{ZFC}$, but does not have consistency strength over $\mathsf{ZFC}$ (in contrast to $\mathbf{\Sigma^1_3}$-measurability, which needs an inaccessible by Shelah). The consistency proof I know is via showing $\mathsf{MA}_{\aleph_1}$ implies the union of $\aleph_1$ many null sets is null, and that in $\mathsf{ZFC}$ any $\mathbf{\Sigma^1_2}$ set is the union of $\aleph_1$ many Borel sets. To get $\mathsf{MA}_{\aleph_1}$ we typically perform an iterated forcing of length $\aleph_2$, and I don't know if something like that can be carried out in second order arithmetic.

Questions: Does $\mathbf{\Sigma^1_2}$-measurability have consistency strength over $\Pi^1_1$-CA$_0$? Over the full second order arithmetic?

$\endgroup$
6
  • $\begingroup$ I'm guessing that in less than $\mathrm{ATR_0}$ you start to run into issues with different definitions of $\Sigma^1_1$ not being equivalent. For instance, I suspect you can't show that every continuous image of a non-empty Borel set is a continuous image of Baire space in something weaker than $\mathrm{ATR}_0$. $\endgroup$ Commented Nov 5 at 2:27
  • $\begingroup$ Uniformisation for $\Pi_1^1$-formulas is often used when working above ATR$_0$. Unfortunately, uniformisation for more complex formulas seems to require extra assumptions (see VII.6.15 in Simpson's sosoa). Hence, your question may depend on these extra assumptions. $\endgroup$ Commented Nov 6 at 10:20
  • $\begingroup$ By the way, why don't you ask this question directly to Thibaut or Juan? Juan might be too busy to get to your question, but there might be a chance Thibaut could answer. But I do not think they have a solid answer in their hand at this moment, as even the proof-theoretic strength of the Lebesgue measurability of $\mathbf{\Sigma}^1_1$ sets is new. $\endgroup$ Commented Nov 8 at 20:31
  • 2
    $\begingroup$ You may also be able to check Thibaut Kouptchinsky's recorded talk on the same topic mentioned in your link. $\endgroup$ Commented Nov 8 at 20:36
  • 2
    $\begingroup$ FWIW another way to force $\mathbf{\Sigma}^1_2$-measurability is with a finite support $\omega_1$-iteration of Amoeba forcing (over $L$, for example). This should be doable in SOA. $\endgroup$ Commented Dec 4 at 10:47

0

You must log in to answer this question.

Start asking to get answers

Find the answer to your question by asking.

Ask question

Explore related questions

See similar questions with these tags.