Mailman 3 December 2025 - Python-list

Re: Python
by rbowman March 11, 2026

March 11, 2026

On Tue, 16 Dec 2025 21:45:42 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > On Mon, 15 Dec 2025 12:57:57 +0000, mm0fmf wrote: > >> On 14 Dec 2025 11:56:42 GMT, Stéphane CARPENTIER wrote: >> >>> My issues with python are: >>> - It's using indentations, so when I comment a block of code to see >> >> ''' and ''' are your friend > > Unless the block has triply-quoted strings inside it ... Yeah, well. I've been burned more than once by someone who added /* stupid comment */ someplace west of the 80th column in the code.

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Annoyance building python from source
by Keith Thompson Jan. 1, 2026

Jan. 1, 2026

When I build Python from source, the "sudo make install" step creates root-owned files in the build directory. I have not seen this while building other open-source packages from source. Is there a way to avoid this, so no root-owned files are creates other than under the target installation directory? The details: I typically build Python from a cloned git directory. The steps (leaving out some irrelevant details) are: git clone https://github.com/python/cpython cd cpython git switch -d VERSION ./configure make sudo make install The last step creates dozens of *.pyc files under the cpython/Lib directory. I've recently started doing builds in a temporary subdirectory: ... mkdir BUILD_DIR cd BUILD_DIR ../configure make sudo make install That does create a lot of files under BUILD_DIR, but I still get a lot of root-owned *.pyc files under the cpython/Lib directory. I have to run some command under sudo ("sudo rm ..." or "sudo git clean ...") to remove these *.pyc files before doing a new clean build, which is a mild annoyance. Without having looked into the details, I would have expected these *.pyc files to be created by `make`, not by `sudo make install`, but perhaps there are good reasons for the way it's done. -- Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) Keith.S.Thompson+u(a)gmail.com void Void(void) { Void(); } /* The recursive call of the void */

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Re: Python
by Dan Espen Jan. 1, 2026

Jan. 1, 2026

Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo(a)nz.invalid> writes: > On Mon, 15 Dec 2025 12:57:57 +0000, mm0fmf wrote: > >> On 14 Dec 2025 11:56:42 GMT, Stéphane CARPENTIER wrote: >> >>> My issues with python are: >>> - It's using indentations, so when I comment a block of code to see >> >> ''' and ''' are your friend > > Unless the block has triply-quoted strings inside it ... Then """ and """ are your better friends. -- Dan Espen

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Challenging argparse with keyword dest="class"
by Schimon Jehudah Dec. 29, 2025

Dec. 29, 2025

Greetings, one and all. I am experimenting with module argparse. I would be glad to know of your opinions about this concern. Notice dest="class". Python software --------------- from argparse import ArgumentParser parser = ArgumentParser(description="Slixfeed OSTN news service setup.") parser.add_argument( "--class", choices=["address", "hostname", "tld"], dest="class") args = parser.parse_args() breakpoint() Execute the software -------------------- -> breakpoint() (Pdb) args.class *** SyntaxError: invalid syntax (Pdb) Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year, Schimon

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ANN: tumblelog 5.9.0: a static microblog generator
by John Bokma Dec. 22, 2025

Dec. 22, 2025

Dear reader, I just released version 5.9.0 of tumblelog, a static microblog generator which generates HTML5, an RSS feed, a JSON feed and optionally tag pages from a single Markdown file with additional directives. Besides small changes to the code since 5.5.0 a new style has been added: mocha. Example microblog: https://plurrrr.com/ GitHub: https://github.com/john-bokma/tumblelog/ -- Static tumblelog generator: https://github.com/john-bokma/tumblelog/ Available as Python or Perl. Example tumblelog: https://plurrrr.com/

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Re: Python
by John Levine Dec. 21, 2025

Dec. 21, 2025

According to c186282 <c186282(a)nnada.net>: > Well ... I'll better understand, and be able to mod, my > old programs better than you. I find 'excessive' commenting > anything BUT 'excessive'. I *enjoy* writing out the meaning > and implications of almost every step. That's fine as long as it's done with adequate discipline i += 2; /* add one more bloofus to i */ -- Regards, John Levine, johnl(a)taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

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Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi)
by candycanearter07 Dec. 21, 2025

Dec. 21, 2025

Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo(a)nz.invalid> wrote at 02:05 this Sunday (GMT): > On 13 Dec 2025 11:55:35 GMT, Stéphane CARPENTIER wrote: > >> Everything else is just a lot of lies. They pretend it's not strongly >> typed, but in the real world you will only encounter a lot of issue if >> you believe that. > > Think about why both JavaScript and PHP need a “===” operator, while > Python does not. > > It’s because Python is strongly typed. I thought it was because JS was too liberal with type-casting to make things true, and the JS devs didn't want to break compatibility. >> ... there are a lot of libraries helping developers. > > Other languages have done that before. Why do you think Python has been > able to leapfrog every prior language in this regard? Perl had a lot of > libraries to its name (still does), and yet that no longer seems to be a > good enough reason to continue using Perl, simply because Python now does > it better. > > It’s because Python has such a strong core language on which to build > extensions. The libraries tend to make heavy use of this. It is quite nice, yeah. -- user <candycane> is generated from /dev/urandom

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Re: Python (was Re: Recent history of vi)
by rbowman Dec. 20, 2025

Dec. 20, 2025

On Fri, 19 Dec 2025 20:58:10 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > On Fri, 19 Dec 2025 13:30:03 -0000 (UTC), candycanearter07 wrote: > >> Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo(a)nz.invalid> wrote at 02:05 this Sunday (GMT): >>> >>> Think about why both JavaScript and PHP need a “===” operator, while >>> Python does not. >>> >>> It’s because Python is strongly typed. >> >> I thought it was because JS was too liberal with type-casting to make >> things true, and the JS devs didn't want to break compatibility. > > Is there some other interpretation of “strongly typed”? I haven't worked with them enough to know if type hints are useful or if they're like TypeScript's attempt to rein in JavaScript. It's like the dunders that are like saying 'Please mugger, don't take my IPad' rather than something that is enforced.

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Re: Python
by Carlos E.R. Dec. 19, 2025

Dec. 19, 2025

On 2025-12-16 00:55, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > On Mon, 15 Dec 2025 18:44:06 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > >> [Python is] the modern BASIC. Great for hacking stuff up, bur bare >> metal it aint. > > Unlike BASIC, Python’s facilities for doing low-level stuff are a bit > more advanced than PEEK and POKE. ;) I don't remember how we did id with the Microsoft basic compiler in the 90's. QC40? I think we linked an external obj or lib file that did the actual job, provided by the manufacturer of the data acquisition card we used. -- Cheers, Carlos. ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;

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AI Generated Usenet Client in Python
by street＠shellcrash.com Dec. 19, 2025

Dec. 19, 2025

AI Generated Usenet Client in Python If you have any improvements to this or helpful ideas I would like to see them. https://github.com/alt-magick/Newsgroup-Client-/ #!/usr/bin/env python3 import nntplib import sys import termios import tty import re import quopri import base64 from email.message import EmailMessage import os import tempfile import subprocess # ================= USER CONFIG ================= NNTP_SERVER = "usnews.blocknews.net" NNTP_PORT = 563 USERNAME = "" PASSWORD = "" PAGE_LINES = 12 MAX_ARTICLES_LIST = 200 MAX_REPLY_SCAN = 300 START_GROUP = "alt.test" SHOW_REPLY_COUNT = False SHOW_REPLY_COUNT_MAIN = True # ============================================== RE_REPLY = re.compile(r"^(re|fwd):", re.IGNORECASE) CLEAN_RE = re.compile(r"[---]") # ---------- STATUS LINE ---------- STATUS_LINE = "" def set_status(msg): global STATUS_LINE STATUS_LINE = msg def show_status(): global STATUS_LINE if STATUS_LINE: print(f" [{STATUS_LINE}]") STATUS_LINE = "" # ---------- RAW KEY INPUT ---------- def get_key(): fd = sys.stdin.fileno() old = termios.tcgetattr(fd) try: tty.setraw(fd) return sys.stdin.read(1) finally: termios.tcsetattr(fd, termios.TCSADRAIN, old) def prompt(text): sys.stdout.write(text) sys.stdout.flush() return sys.stdin.readline().strip() # ---------- HARD-CODED PAGER ---------- def paged_print(lines): i = 0 total = len(lines) while i < total: end = min(i + PAGE_LINES, total) for line in lines[i:end]: print(line) i = end if i >= total: break print(" --- ENTER = next page | SPACE = skip ---") if get_key() == " ": break # ---------- BODY DECODER ---------- def decode_body_line(line_bytes): s = line_bytes.decode("utf-8", errors="replace") s = CLEAN_RE.sub("", s) if "=" in s: try: s = quopri.decodestring(s).decode("utf-8", errors="replace") except Exception: pass if re.fullmatch(r"[A-Za-z0-9+/=\s]+", s) and len(s.strip()) > 20: try: s = base64.b64decode(s, validate=True).decode("utf-8", errors="replace") except Exception: pass return s # ---------- POST BODY EDITOR ---------- def edit_body(initial=""): editor = os.environ.get("EDITOR", "nano") fd, path = tempfile.mkstemp(suffix=".txt") try: with os.fdopen(fd, "w") as f: f.write(initial) subprocess.call([editor, path]) with open(path, "r") as f: return f.read() finally: os.unlink(path) # ---------- POST BODY SOURCE ---------- def get_post_body(): print(" Post body source:") print(" E = Edit in editor") print(" F = Load from external text file") print(" T = Type directly in terminal") choice = get_key().lower() if choice == "f": path = prompt(" Enter path to text file: ") try: with open(path, "r", encoding="utf-8", errors="replace") as f: body = f.read() if not body.strip(): set_status("Post aborted (file is empty)") return None return body except Exception as e: set_status(f"Failed to read file: {e}") return None elif choice == "t": print(" Type your post below. End with a period on a line by itself.") lines = [] while True: line = input() if line.strip() == ".": break # stop input when user enters a single period on a line lines.append(line) body = " ".join(lines) if not body.strip(): set_status("Post aborted (empty input)") return None return body # default: editor body = edit_body() if not body.strip(): set_status("Post aborted (empty body)") return None return body # ---------- POSTING ---------- def post_article(nntp, group, subject=None, references=None): name = prompt("Enter your display name: ") email = prompt("Enter your email: ") if not subject: subject = prompt("Enter subject: ") body = get_post_body() if not body: return False msg = EmailMessage() msg["From"] = f"{name} <{email}>" msg["Newsgroups"] = group msg["Subject"] = subject if references: msg["References"] = references msg.set_content(body) try: nntp.post(msg.as_bytes()) set_status("Article posted successfully") return True except Exception as e: set_status(f"Post failed: {e}") return False # ---------- REPLY POSTING ---------- def post_reply(nntp, group, article_num): try: _, hinfo = nntp.head(str(article_num)) headers = {} for raw in hinfo.lines: line = decode_body_line(raw) if ":" in line: k, v = line.split(":", 1) headers[k.lower()] = v.strip() subject = headers.get("subject", "(no subject)") if not RE_REPLY.match(subject): subject = "Re: " + subject refs = [] if "references" in headers: refs.append(headers["references"]) if "message-id" in headers: refs.append(headers["message-id"]) return post_article(nntp, group, subject, " ".join(refs)) except Exception as e: set_status(f"Reply failed: {e}") return False # ---------- ARTICLE DISPLAY ---------- def show_article(nntp, num, group=None, allow_reply=False): try: _, hinfo = nntp.head(str(num)) headers = {} for raw in hinfo.lines: line = decode_body_line(raw) if ":" in line: k, v = line.split(":", 1) headers[k.lower()] = v.strip() _, body = nntp.body(str(num)) lines = [decode_body_line(l) for l in body.lines] paged_print([ f"From: {headers.get('from','?')}", f"Date: {headers.get('date','?')}", f"Subject: {headers.get('subject','(no subject)')}", "" ] + lines) if allow_reply and group: print(" P=reply (any other key to continue)") if get_key().lower() == "p": post_reply(nntp, group, num) except Exception as e: set_status(f"Fetch failed: {e}") # ---------- REPLY SCANNING ---------- def scan_replies_xover(nntp, msgid, first, last): replies = [] start = max(first, last - MAX_REPLY_SCAN) try: _, overviews = nntp.over((start, last)) except: return replies for num, hdr in overviews: if msgid in hdr.get("references", ""): replies.append(int(num)) return replies # ---------- GROUP RELOAD ---------- def reload_group(nntp, group): try: _, _, first, last, _ = nntp.group(group) first = int(first) last = int(last) _, overviews = nntp.over((max(first, last - MAX_ARTICLES_LIST), last)) posts = [] for num, hdr in reversed(overviews): subject = hdr.get("subject", "") if RE_REPLY.match(subject): continue msgid = hdr.get("message-id", "") replies = sum( 1 for _, h in overviews if msgid in h.get("references", "") ) if SHOW_REPLY_COUNT_MAIN else 0 posts.append({ "num": int(num), "subject": CLEAN_RE.sub("", subject), "from": CLEAN_RE.sub("", hdr.get("from", "?")), "date": hdr.get("date", "?"), "msgid": msgid, "replies": replies }) return posts, first, last except Exception as e: set_status(f"Reload failed: {e}") return None, None, None # ---------- GROUP BROWSER ---------- def browse_group(nntp, group): posts, first, last = reload_group(nntp, group) if not posts: return index = 0 while index < len(posts): p = posts[index] print(f" [{index+1}] #{p['num']}") print(f"From: {p['from']}") print(f"Date: {p['date']}") print(f"Replies: {p['replies'] if SHOW_REPLY_COUNT_MAIN else '?'}") print(f"Subject: {p['subject']}") show_status() print(" ENTER=read SPACE=next R=replies N=new post L=reload J=jump G=group Q=quit") key = get_key().lower() if key == "q": sys.exit(0) elif key == " ": index += 1 elif key in (" ", " "): show_article(nntp, p["num"], group, True) elif key == "n": if post_article(nntp, group): posts, first, last = reload_group(nntp, group) index = 0 elif key == "l": posts, first, last = reload_group(nntp, group) index = 0 set_status("Group reloaded") elif key == "j": val = prompt("Jump to post number: ") if val.isdigit(): idx = int(val) - 1 if 0 <= idx < len(posts): index = idx elif key == "g": browse_group(nntp, prompt("New group: ")) return elif key == "r": replies = scan_replies_xover(nntp, p["msgid"], first, last) if not replies: set_status("No replies found") continue for i, rnum in enumerate(replies): if i < len(replies) - 1: print(" ENTER=next reply | SPACE=skip remaining | P=reply") else: print(" End of replies | P=reply") k = get_key().lower() if k == " ": set_status("Skipped remaining replies") break elif k == "p": post_reply(nntp, group, rnum) elif k in (" ", " "): show_article(nntp, rnum, group, True) # ---------- MAIN ---------- def main(): print(f"Connecting to {NNTP_SERVER}:{NNTP_PORT}...") nntp = nntplib.NNTP_SSL(NNTP_SERVER, NNTP_PORT, USERNAME, PASSWORD) set_status("Connected") browse_group(nntp, START_GROUP) nntp.quit() if __name__ == "__main__": main()

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